There are a lot of thoughtful comments about this post from Rick Wilson, but few touch upon just how utterly ludicrous and fraudulent the claim of absolutely immunity is, and how untethered to the constitution or statute or precedent it actually is.
To their credit, Judges Henderson, Pan, and Childs eschewed any potentially incendiary adverbs and adjectives, no doubt owing in equal measure to their professionalism and what I think is an undeserved civility. I say that because it has now become commonplace for lawyers to forget two particular provisions of their Oath of Attorney:
"I will not counsel or maintain any suit or proceedings which shall appear to me to be unjust, nor any defense except such as I believe to be honestly debatable under the law of the land ...." And "I will never . . . delay anyone’s cause for lucre or malice."
On what planet is one entitled to immunity for ordering the assassination of his political rivals "honestly debatable" and not made for purposes of delay? Making the claim itself was not just wrong, it was, I suggest, unethical.
If it does get taken up by the McConnell Court then once again they have to choose: Trump or the Constitution? Given how compromised some of those slimeballs are, I'm not confident about the outcome.
My take is that there will be a 5-4 split in the conference to take up the petition for certiorari, with Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch and one of Kavanaugh or Bennett to bring it up and the Roberts, Kagan, Sotomayor, Jackson and one of Kavanaugh or Bennett to pass. There are only two reasons to bring it: either to strengthen it (hard to see how) or to overturn it. The discussion in conference will feature the majority asking the minority where they see the holes in the Circuit panel decision. When the answer comes back with a lot of arm waving, the hanging question will be "so you think you can get one of us to sign on to that?" The implication is "let's not bring this up solely for the purpose of writing dissents." That will peel off Gorsuch or one of Kavanugh or Bennett leaving a 6-3 split and no cert.
The Chief is, above all else, an institutionalist. He's going to pull the stops to keep the Court from becoming a prop for a Trump II administration that will respect no past or future decision of the Court by making him truly above the law. On the other hand, by denying cert. and letting it stand, in the event of a Trump II anyway, the Court can expect to attract slightly less ire from Trump for its sin of omission over owning the result affirmatively.
Not necessarily, Peter. So far, I’ve only seen Chris Geidner focus on the judgment section of the decision under which the mandate of the Court issues next Monday the 12th unless one of 2 things happens: 1. The DC Circuit agrees to rehear this case either the 3 judges (no way) or en banc (also very unlikely). Or 2. Not only does SCOTUS grant certiorari (which takes 4 Justices) but it also enters its own stay (takes 5 Justices). If they do not stay the lower court proceedings, discovery will resume in the case before Judge Chutkan. She’s estimated 2 months for the rest of discovery, so trial could start in mid-April, with a trial and a decision before the Election!
THESE BOTTOM OF THE SWAM SLIME ARE SCARED SHITLESS. The appeals court RULED AGAINST IMMUNITY FOR EX PRESIDENTS........ THE IS ONLY 1 POTUS. THE MAN IN OFFICE, JOE BIDEN. Boy those 2 slime were planning on being in office for life. With the new government plan, made for trump to be a dictator. ALL DETAILS IN PROJECT 25
The opinion is, indeed, ironclad. Casino Mussolini’s claim of immunity for crimes committed against the United States was rejected out of hand by the Circuit Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia. Trump is therefore not going to be able to get away with “shooting someone in the middle of Fifth Avenue” without losing the votes of three appellate judges.
The opinion is 57 pages long, and I suggest it was specifically designed to leave the door open to the Supreme Court to slam it shut in Donald Trump’s face by simply refusing to hear it. I had feared that the reason it took Judges Henderson, Pan and Childs a month to write this was due to dissension among them on its scope. Those fears were not realized, thank God.
Instead, it appears that the three-judge panel wanted to countersink every single nail in Donald Trump's coffin by dispensing with every conceivable argument one might possibly make in support of his ridiculous “President as King claim. The light you see at the end of the tunnel is a trial for Donald Trump on four felony charges brought by Jack Smith. And the light that Donald Trump sees at the end of the tunnel is from an oncoming train.
And it's now a good thing, that Evil Joe Biden has to call off his dogs from removing Trump from the board, the nasty way (wet-work nasty). He now has to show him up in the ballots, if he even gets to the General Election....
[sarcasm off]
We just need to make sure everyone gets registered and out to vote in Nov!!
LOL LOL LOL LOL Learn the facts and what you are blubbering about. BIDEN HAD DONE NOTHING. Demon, convicted rapist trump is pure hate evil lies. HE IS FACT CHECKED AT 40,000 LIES TOLD in his term. He lies daily. But magats are so gullible, and do not give a crap about truth, FACTS and the damage the rapist trump did to our country.
You have no clue how our govt. works. BIDEN, THE DOJ, THE FBI have nothing to do in duetting search warrants, convictions, arrest warrants. The indictments are handed down by the grand jury. The grand jury hears all witnesses, sees all evidence. Like the 11,000 texts Mark Meadows turned over investigators. This evidence, from trumps #1in the WH,his chief of staff. With coup plans, to overthrow our government. The will of the voters. 8 million more for Pres Biden than the convicted rapist. Trump knew he was going to loose, he knew HE DID LOOSE. As Ivanka Trump, his princess testified to under oath.
It was on video, played for the public. HIS DAUGHTER HER HUSBAND TESTIFIED THAT THE RAPIST STARTED PLANNING THIS COUP IN NOV. AFTER THE ELECTION. He planned
with his multiple co conspirators Over 100 GQP congress members, The 86 people charged in Ga. Many have made deals and SPILLED THEIR GUTS. PLEAD GUILTY. TURNED OVER ALLLLLLL EVIDENCE THEY HAD. They all admitted they conspired with the rapist to overthrow the will of the people the 2020 POTUS election. They lied made plans around the country to get people to act as electors. THEY WERE NOT LEGAL ELECTORS. These anti. American liars have been charged in multiple states. This is treason. The head of the plan THE ORANGE RAPIST. The constitution says anyone involved in an insurrection is NOT ELIGIBLE TO HOLD ANY OFFICE IN THE US GOVT. SO HERE YOU GO GENIUS......
THIS IS PER THE CONSTITUTION. HAS BEEN IN THERE FOR OVER 100 YEARS. THE ONLY
PROPLE THAT CAN CHANGE THIS IS 2/3 OF CONGRESS. OR THE SUPREME COURT CAN RULE ON IT. TRUMP IS SO HATED ESP. NOW AFTER A RAPE CONVICTION. HE REFUSED TO TAKE A DNA TEST, THE WOMAN STILL HAD THE DRESS WITH DNA ON IT. IF HE WOULD NOT TAKEA DNA THEN HES A LIAR SND RAPIST. REMOVING THE RAPIST TRUMP FROM WHAT BOARD. THE DERANGED EX POTUS HAD NO SAY IN ANYTHING. HE HAS NO RIGHT TO DO OF BE ANYTHING IN THE GOVT. HE HAD NO RIGHT TO IMMUNITY FROM ALL THESE CRIMES HE ADMITTED HE DID BY INSISTING HE HAD IMMUNITY FROM ANY/ALL CRIMES HE COMMITTED WHILE POTUS. SUCH DEMENTED THINKING; ONLY A GUILTY PERSON WOULD BE SCARED SHITLESS AND CLAIM THIS. THE APPEALS COURT TODAY THREW OUT HIS CLAIM TO THIS BS, IMMUNITY. NO IMMUNITY ONLY FOR THE POTUS. ONLY 1 POTUS AT A TIME. JOE BIDEN, NOT THE TREASONOUS LYING, CORRUT EX POTUS IS GOING DOWN. TRUMP WILL NEVER BE POTUS AGAIN.
Billy Bailey, Is this addressed to E_T? ("Learn the facts and what you are blubbering about.", "You have no clue how our govt. works.", etc.?)
After his first brief paragraph, he writes: "[sarcasm off]" (which indicates that his first paragraph WAS being sarcastic.) Then he says: "We just need to make sure everyone gets registered and out to vote in Nov!!"
Yepper, I was being sarcastic without being super cude, but still pointing out how Biden could have sent out a kill team, as soon as they had said it was o.k. to do so (and Trump would have been crapping his diapers like no tomorrow). But sanity continues to reign and grows ever stronger...
But no matter what, Trumpism is alive and well and we still have a long fight to keep them from destroying what we have today. Trump himself was dealt a huge blow today and hopefully a few cultist might see the light.
And to keep from going to actual blows, we need to soundly defeat them at the ballot box. Hence, get others registered (and make sure they verify that registration is good as there are ongoing things to remove people from the voter rolls). For them to do the research for all issues and elections that are on all of the ballots. Make sure you vote in special elections. Be careful of tricky worded ballot initiatives (like they recently tried to do in OH) to make you vote the wrong way. Mark every election on a ballot (never leave a race or issue on a ballot empty of anything - because fraud DOES happen and an empty ballot on the sheet is an invitation for someone to fill it in...) Vote early and vote for every election. Get others out to vote as well. Make it a party, if you need to to get others to the polls. Vote, vote, vote!!
Oh, but they can. Only Chris Geidner so far seems to have highlighted the judgment part of this decision under which the mandate of the Court issues next Monday the 12th, allowing Judge Chutkan to resume discovery in her court unless one of 2 things happens: 1. The DC Circuit agrees to rehear this case en banc - unlikely - or 2. Not only does SCOTUS grant certiorari (take 4 Justices) but it also enters its own stay (takes 5 Justices). If they do not stay the lower court proceedings, discovery will resume in the case before Judge Chutkan. She’s estimated 2 months for the rest of discovery, so trial could start in mid-April, with a trial and a decision before the Election!
Donald's lawyers' arguments in the 14th Amendment case are just as specious as they used in this case. However 5 justices very well may find a tiny crack they can use to allow Donald to remain on the ballot. Common sense does not prevail in this time. The reptilian appeal to corruption is strong.
And it's not really strange at all that this amendment is the one that he desperately wants to revoke (he claims because of the Birther part, but he's never talking about the other sections in his rally's, Trump would like nothing better than to kill multiple things with one blow...).
Even if 4 Justices agree to grant certiorari, it will take 5 Justices to stay the lower court proceedings given how the judges in the DC Circuit wrote their judgment. Let’s hope that Justice Roberts and at least one of the newer 3 Justices want to let Judge Chutkan’s discovery process proceed. Or with this strong opinion, SCOTUS might even deny cert.!
There are a lot of thoughtful comments about this post from Rick Wilson, but few touch upon just how utterly ludicrous and fraudulent the claim of absolutely immunity is, and how untethered to the constitution or statute or precedent it actually is.
To their credit, Judges Henderson, Pan, and Childs eschewed any potentially incendiary adverbs and adjectives, no doubt owing in equal measure to their professionalism and what I think is an undeserved civility. I say that because it has now become commonplace for lawyers to forget two particular provisions of their Oath of Attorney:
"I will not counsel or maintain any suit or proceedings which shall appear to me to be unjust, nor any defense except such as I believe to be honestly debatable under the law of the land ...." And "I will never . . . delay anyone’s cause for lucre or malice."
On what planet is one entitled to immunity for ordering the assassination of his political rivals "honestly debatable" and not made for purposes of delay? Making the claim itself was not just wrong, it was, I suggest, unethical.
The journey begins…
Just a reminder that the current Supreme Court leans toward the political right
But what do I know.
purplemessenger.substack.com
If it does get taken up by the McConnell Court then once again they have to choose: Trump or the Constitution? Given how compromised some of those slimeballs are, I'm not confident about the outcome.
My take is that there will be a 5-4 split in the conference to take up the petition for certiorari, with Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch and one of Kavanaugh or Bennett to bring it up and the Roberts, Kagan, Sotomayor, Jackson and one of Kavanaugh or Bennett to pass. There are only two reasons to bring it: either to strengthen it (hard to see how) or to overturn it. The discussion in conference will feature the majority asking the minority where they see the holes in the Circuit panel decision. When the answer comes back with a lot of arm waving, the hanging question will be "so you think you can get one of us to sign on to that?" The implication is "let's not bring this up solely for the purpose of writing dissents." That will peel off Gorsuch or one of Kavanugh or Bennett leaving a 6-3 split and no cert.
The Chief is, above all else, an institutionalist. He's going to pull the stops to keep the Court from becoming a prop for a Trump II administration that will respect no past or future decision of the Court by making him truly above the law. On the other hand, by denying cert. and letting it stand, in the event of a Trump II anyway, the Court can expect to attract slightly less ire from Trump for its sin of omission over owning the result affirmatively.
High time!! I doubt Ginni shares our enthusiasm. I’d sure like to be a fly on that wall.
Trump looks bad.
It’s a victory re the rule of law, but Trump managed to delay the DC case for, what, two months??
Not necessarily, Peter. So far, I’ve only seen Chris Geidner focus on the judgment section of the decision under which the mandate of the Court issues next Monday the 12th unless one of 2 things happens: 1. The DC Circuit agrees to rehear this case either the 3 judges (no way) or en banc (also very unlikely). Or 2. Not only does SCOTUS grant certiorari (which takes 4 Justices) but it also enters its own stay (takes 5 Justices). If they do not stay the lower court proceedings, discovery will resume in the case before Judge Chutkan. She’s estimated 2 months for the rest of discovery, so trial could start in mid-April, with a trial and a decision before the Election!
Excellent analysis/celebration.
While Trump (& Trump Jr!) are ranting & raving that “America will not survive!” If the President doesn’t have absolute immunity forever…
…they never address the fact that in nearly 250 years, not one President has even asked for it before.
THESE BOTTOM OF THE SWAM SLIME ARE SCARED SHITLESS. The appeals court RULED AGAINST IMMUNITY FOR EX PRESIDENTS........ THE IS ONLY 1 POTUS. THE MAN IN OFFICE, JOE BIDEN. Boy those 2 slime were planning on being in office for life. With the new government plan, made for trump to be a dictator. ALL DETAILS IN PROJECT 25
By the way, Trump has already copped to all the charges; otherwise why the need for immunity?
The opinion is, indeed, ironclad. Casino Mussolini’s claim of immunity for crimes committed against the United States was rejected out of hand by the Circuit Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia. Trump is therefore not going to be able to get away with “shooting someone in the middle of Fifth Avenue” without losing the votes of three appellate judges.
The opinion is 57 pages long, and I suggest it was specifically designed to leave the door open to the Supreme Court to slam it shut in Donald Trump’s face by simply refusing to hear it. I had feared that the reason it took Judges Henderson, Pan and Childs a month to write this was due to dissension among them on its scope. Those fears were not realized, thank God.
Instead, it appears that the three-judge panel wanted to countersink every single nail in Donald Trump's coffin by dispensing with every conceivable argument one might possibly make in support of his ridiculous “President as King claim. The light you see at the end of the tunnel is a trial for Donald Trump on four felony charges brought by Jack Smith. And the light that Donald Trump sees at the end of the tunnel is from an oncoming train.
Love "Casino Mussolini"...so perfectly apt
I with I could say it's original, but truth be told, I should've credited the inimitable Samantha Bee for that. She coined the term.
Well said! It was my fear too - and my enormous relief!
Thank you my friend. May I call you a friend?
And it's now a good thing, that Evil Joe Biden has to call off his dogs from removing Trump from the board, the nasty way (wet-work nasty). He now has to show him up in the ballots, if he even gets to the General Election....
[sarcasm off]
We just need to make sure everyone gets registered and out to vote in Nov!!
LOL LOL LOL LOL Learn the facts and what you are blubbering about. BIDEN HAD DONE NOTHING. Demon, convicted rapist trump is pure hate evil lies. HE IS FACT CHECKED AT 40,000 LIES TOLD in his term. He lies daily. But magats are so gullible, and do not give a crap about truth, FACTS and the damage the rapist trump did to our country.
You have no clue how our govt. works. BIDEN, THE DOJ, THE FBI have nothing to do in duetting search warrants, convictions, arrest warrants. The indictments are handed down by the grand jury. The grand jury hears all witnesses, sees all evidence. Like the 11,000 texts Mark Meadows turned over investigators. This evidence, from trumps #1in the WH,his chief of staff. With coup plans, to overthrow our government. The will of the voters. 8 million more for Pres Biden than the convicted rapist. Trump knew he was going to loose, he knew HE DID LOOSE. As Ivanka Trump, his princess testified to under oath.
It was on video, played for the public. HIS DAUGHTER HER HUSBAND TESTIFIED THAT THE RAPIST STARTED PLANNING THIS COUP IN NOV. AFTER THE ELECTION. He planned
with his multiple co conspirators Over 100 GQP congress members, The 86 people charged in Ga. Many have made deals and SPILLED THEIR GUTS. PLEAD GUILTY. TURNED OVER ALLLLLLL EVIDENCE THEY HAD. They all admitted they conspired with the rapist to overthrow the will of the people the 2020 POTUS election. They lied made plans around the country to get people to act as electors. THEY WERE NOT LEGAL ELECTORS. These anti. American liars have been charged in multiple states. This is treason. The head of the plan THE ORANGE RAPIST. The constitution says anyone involved in an insurrection is NOT ELIGIBLE TO HOLD ANY OFFICE IN THE US GOVT. SO HERE YOU GO GENIUS......
THIS IS PER THE CONSTITUTION. HAS BEEN IN THERE FOR OVER 100 YEARS. THE ONLY
PROPLE THAT CAN CHANGE THIS IS 2/3 OF CONGRESS. OR THE SUPREME COURT CAN RULE ON IT. TRUMP IS SO HATED ESP. NOW AFTER A RAPE CONVICTION. HE REFUSED TO TAKE A DNA TEST, THE WOMAN STILL HAD THE DRESS WITH DNA ON IT. IF HE WOULD NOT TAKEA DNA THEN HES A LIAR SND RAPIST. REMOVING THE RAPIST TRUMP FROM WHAT BOARD. THE DERANGED EX POTUS HAD NO SAY IN ANYTHING. HE HAS NO RIGHT TO DO OF BE ANYTHING IN THE GOVT. HE HAD NO RIGHT TO IMMUNITY FROM ALL THESE CRIMES HE ADMITTED HE DID BY INSISTING HE HAD IMMUNITY FROM ANY/ALL CRIMES HE COMMITTED WHILE POTUS. SUCH DEMENTED THINKING; ONLY A GUILTY PERSON WOULD BE SCARED SHITLESS AND CLAIM THIS. THE APPEALS COURT TODAY THREW OUT HIS CLAIM TO THIS BS, IMMUNITY. NO IMMUNITY ONLY FOR THE POTUS. ONLY 1 POTUS AT A TIME. JOE BIDEN, NOT THE TREASONOUS LYING, CORRUT EX POTUS IS GOING DOWN. TRUMP WILL NEVER BE POTUS AGAIN.
Billy Bailey, Is this addressed to E_T? ("Learn the facts and what you are blubbering about.", "You have no clue how our govt. works.", etc.?)
After his first brief paragraph, he writes: "[sarcasm off]" (which indicates that his first paragraph WAS being sarcastic.) Then he says: "We just need to make sure everyone gets registered and out to vote in Nov!!"
You misread him completely.
Yepper, I was being sarcastic without being super cude, but still pointing out how Biden could have sent out a kill team, as soon as they had said it was o.k. to do so (and Trump would have been crapping his diapers like no tomorrow). But sanity continues to reign and grows ever stronger...
But no matter what, Trumpism is alive and well and we still have a long fight to keep them from destroying what we have today. Trump himself was dealt a huge blow today and hopefully a few cultist might see the light.
And to keep from going to actual blows, we need to soundly defeat them at the ballot box. Hence, get others registered (and make sure they verify that registration is good as there are ongoing things to remove people from the voter rolls). For them to do the research for all issues and elections that are on all of the ballots. Make sure you vote in special elections. Be careful of tricky worded ballot initiatives (like they recently tried to do in OH) to make you vote the wrong way. Mark every election on a ballot (never leave a race or issue on a ballot empty of anything - because fraud DOES happen and an empty ballot on the sheet is an invitation for someone to fill it in...) Vote early and vote for every election. Get others out to vote as well. Make it a party, if you need to to get others to the polls. Vote, vote, vote!!
Seal Team 6 has been commanded to Stand Down.
With this ruling being so solid, why can't they continue moving towards the trial while it possibly goes to SCOTUS?
Oh, but they can. Only Chris Geidner so far seems to have highlighted the judgment part of this decision under which the mandate of the Court issues next Monday the 12th, allowing Judge Chutkan to resume discovery in her court unless one of 2 things happens: 1. The DC Circuit agrees to rehear this case en banc - unlikely - or 2. Not only does SCOTUS grant certiorari (take 4 Justices) but it also enters its own stay (takes 5 Justices). If they do not stay the lower court proceedings, discovery will resume in the case before Judge Chutkan. She’s estimated 2 months for the rest of discovery, so trial could start in mid-April, with a trial and a decision before the Election!
Donald's lawyers' arguments in the 14th Amendment case are just as specious as they used in this case. However 5 justices very well may find a tiny crack they can use to allow Donald to remain on the ballot. Common sense does not prevail in this time. The reptilian appeal to corruption is strong.
And it's not really strange at all that this amendment is the one that he desperately wants to revoke (he claims because of the Birther part, but he's never talking about the other sections in his rally's, Trump would like nothing better than to kill multiple things with one blow...).
Let's hope SCOTUS opts not to hear tfg's appeal...since the appellate court's decision was unanimous.
Then it's bring on Judge Chutkan, Jack Smith and the federal election interference trial, baby!
Even if 4 Justices agree to grant certiorari, it will take 5 Justices to stay the lower court proceedings given how the judges in the DC Circuit wrote their judgment. Let’s hope that Justice Roberts and at least one of the newer 3 Justices want to let Judge Chutkan’s discovery process proceed. Or with this strong opinion, SCOTUS might even deny cert.!
🤞🤞
Remember, remember the fifth of November......
Its amazing that this year election day is also Guy Faulks day. Hoping for no gunpowder!